Madison County commissioner John Pethel questioned his fellow board members’ training expenses Monday, leading to a heated confrontation at the BOC table.
Each year, commissioners have an expense account for conducting county business. The primary cost in those accounts is for commissioners’ education classes. Board members can take classes on road matters, legislative issues and other subjects related to governing a county.
Last year, three commissioners exceeded their expense budgets due to training costs. They included Stanley Thomas, whose $4,182 in expenses exceeded his $2,530 budget by 65 percent; Mike Youngblood, whose $4,588 in expenses exceeded his $2,810 budget by 63 percent; and Dewitt “Pete” Bond, whose $4,006 in expenses exceeded his $2,960 budget by 35 percent.
“For a commissioner to go 60 and 61 percent over their budget, I don’t agree with that,” said Pethel. “I know there’s probably excuses that they have, but there is no reason and no excuse for going over budget.”
Pethel said department heads aren’t supposed to exceed their budgets, so neither should commissioners. He said Bond is a new commissioner. Therefore, he didn’t have as much of a problem with him exceeding his training budget as Thomas or Youngblood, who have been on the board much longer.
“What I don’t understand is how we can sit up here and ask all the department heads to make adjustments and get your budget down to keep from raising taxes,” said Pethel. “Well, how are we going to do that this year, when the commissioners are going 60 to 61 percent over their budget. And I don’t see how you can allow this to happen. They just keep spending and spending and spending, knowing what their budget is.”
Training expenses: BOC members clash on what’s appropriate
Thomas said that he doesn’t take a cell phone from the county, doesn’t have a fax line and doesn’t ever charge for gas, though he often travels to Atlanta to try and make sure Madison County’s interests are being considered by legislators, adding that he has secured $205,000 in grant funds for the county. He said he worked for free as the county’s real estate agent in securing a new locale for Fine Finish, a program for the county’s developmentally challenged adults.
“I gave up a $25,000 commission that I would have for the same work I do when I do real estate work in Athens,” said Thomas. “I don’t take money from this county. It costs me money.”
Thomas said BOC members don’t know what classes will be offered in the following year when they set their budget. With that in mind, the commissioners voted 5-0 in December 2010 to adjust BOC expense accounts as necessary to cover additional education costs.
But Pethel said he didn’t approve a “blank check” for training.
“There was never a dollar amount mentioned and I waited and waited and it was gone and thought we wouldn’t do a budget amendment,” said Pethel.
Thomas said he believes his fellow board member is raising the issue simply to hurt him in an election year. The District 1 commissioner will be up for re-election this year, along with the county commission chairman and the District 4 seat, currently held by Bond. He noted that Pethel is not up for election this year and so he can raise a stink and hurt only those up for election.
“It’s a shame that Mr. Pethel’s political agenda will drive him to criticize board members for using the valuable resources the state provides in education and training,” said Thomas Tuesday. “This training is vital to keep Madison County up to date on laws and economic strategies to get us through these trying times.”
Pethel said he is not politically motivated.
“That’s just not true,” he said, adding that Youngblood is not up for re-election this year and he noted the District 3 commissioner’s expenses, too. “This is not politically motivated.”
Thomas pointed out Tuesday that Pethel slightly exceeded his expense account budget in 2008. County records show Pethel’s expenses that year were $2,075 and his budget was $2,010. Pethel said he was never aware that he was slightly over budget that year and said he believes it must have been a mistake related to phone expenses.
In the past few years, Pethel has been far under budget. For instance, the year after he exceeded his budget, he spent just $281, though he had budgeted $2,010 for training and other expenses. Pethel says training is important and that he plans to attend the upcoming commissioners’ convention in April. He said he missed the past two due to family health issues. Pethel said his fellow members have gone overboard with training.
“It irritates me that the taxpayer money is being spent on every training class that comes along when it’s not necessary,” said Pethel.
Thomas said the training is worthwhile and Bond agreed, saying he gets a lot out of the classes. Thomas said Tuesday that he can’t see how Pethel shows so much concern for taxpayers when he was ready to spend roughly $300,000 in taxpayer funds on fighting to keep Sam Bruce Road open in the Harrison district. The county was engaged in a lengthy legal battle with Marion “Hoss” Cartwright over the road. Pethel said all the board members agreed to pay those expenses for legal fees and engineering costs. But Thomas said it was Pethel who pushed and pushed the matter.
Youngblood told Pethel Monday that his lack of training was evident.
“It’s pretty obvious that some of the decisions that some of the board members can sit up here and make, and comments that they make, they need the training,” said Youngblood.
Pethel smiled and laughed a little.
“That’s that little snicker; you hear that?” Youngblood said to the audience. “It’s pretty obvious that some of the decisions that you have made, you need to go to some training. If you’ve got $2,000 left in your budget at the end of the year, maybe you need to give that up. Any one of us can sit here and condemn us for going and getting trained. That’s a little ridiculous. But, you know, everyone’s got their own little wagon they’ve got to ride in.”
Pethel said he didn’t intend to make anyone feel bad.
“You didn’t make me feel bad; I guarantee you the money I spent was well worth it,” said Youngblood, interjecting as Pethel talked.
“Can you call point of order when he’s interrupting me like you do with me interrupting him?” Pethel asked chairman Anthony Dove, who answered “Yes.” “OK, well I’d appreciate if you’d do that … Like I said, my point is spending taxpayers’ money unnecessarily. I agree with going to school once or twice a year, but when you spend $1,600 more than you budgeted when you’re going and spending taxpayer money and staying in a hotel and eating off the county and all that, that is what I didn’t agree with.”
Thomas said Tuesday that he always eats cheaply when going to training and that he is not squandering any money by getting training that he said helps him understand local and state issues.
Larry Stewart, who is seeking the seat currently held by Bond on the BOC, took the podium at the conclusion of the meeting and said he could see all sides.
“I think the problem is not whether you’re over or under, and that sort of thing,” said Stewart. “I think from the public’s perspective, what is needed is a more transparent way of these budget amendments being made. It gives the appearance that people are spending money over their budget and that the money is being made up somehow and it’s being shuffled around and maybe something’s not quite right. I’m not saying that’s the case. But I’m saying it gives that appearance.”
“I gave up a $25,000 commission that I would have for the same work I do when I do real estate work in Athens,” said Thomas. “I don’t take money from this county. It costs me money.”
Thomas said BOC members don’t know what classes will be offered in the following year when they set their budget. With that in mind, the commissioners voted 5-0 in December 2010 to adjust BOC expense accounts as necessary to cover additional education costs.
But Pethel said he didn’t approve a “blank check” for training.
“There was never a dollar amount mentioned and I waited and waited and it was gone and thought we wouldn’t do a budget amendment,” said Pethel.
Thomas said he believes his fellow board member is raising the issue simply to hurt him in an election year. The District 1 commissioner will be up for re-election this year, along with the county commission chairman and the District 4 seat, currently held by Bond. He noted that Pethel is not up for election this year and so he can raise a stink and hurt only those up for election.
“It’s a shame that Mr. Pethel’s political agenda will drive him to criticize board members for using the valuable resources the state provides in education and training,” said Thomas Tuesday. “This training is vital to keep Madison County up to date on laws and economic strategies to get us through these trying times.”
Pethel said he is not politically motivated.
“That’s just not true,” he said, adding that Youngblood is not up for re-election this year and he noted the District 3 commissioner’s expenses, too. “This is not politically motivated.”
Thomas pointed out Tuesday that Pethel slightly exceeded his expense account budget in 2008. County records show Pethel’s expenses that year were $2,075 and his budget was $2,010. Pethel said he was never aware that he was slightly over budget that year and said he believes it must have been a mistake related to phone expenses.
In the past few years, Pethel has been far under budget. For instance, the year after he exceeded his budget, he spent just $281, though he had budgeted $2,010 for training and other expenses. Pethel says training is important and that he plans to attend the upcoming commissioners’ convention in April. He said he missed the past two due to family health issues. Pethel said his fellow members have gone overboard with training.
“It irritates me that the taxpayer money is being spent on every training class that comes along when it’s not necessary,” said Pethel.
Thomas said the training is worthwhile and Bond agreed, saying he gets a lot out of the classes. Thomas said Tuesday that he can’t see how Pethel shows so much concern for taxpayers when he was ready to spend roughly $300,000 in taxpayer funds on fighting to keep Sam Bruce Road open in the Harrison district. The county was engaged in a lengthy legal battle with Marion “Hoss” Cartwright over the road. Pethel said all the board members agreed to pay those expenses for legal fees and engineering costs. But Thomas said it was Pethel who pushed and pushed the matter.
Youngblood told Pethel Monday that his lack of training was evident.
“It’s pretty obvious that some of the decisions that some of the board members can sit up here and make, and comments that they make, they need the training,” said Youngblood.
Pethel smiled and laughed a little.
“That’s that little snicker; you hear that?” Youngblood said to the audience. “It’s pretty obvious that some of the decisions that you have made, you need to go to some training. If you’ve got $2,000 left in your budget at the end of the year, maybe you need to give that up. Any one of us can sit here and condemn us for going and getting trained. That’s a little ridiculous. But, you know, everyone’s got their own little wagon they’ve got to ride in.”
Pethel said he didn’t intend to make anyone feel bad.
“You didn’t make me feel bad; I guarantee you the money I spent was well worth it,” said Youngblood, interjecting as Pethel talked.
“Can you call point of order when he’s interrupting me like you do with me interrupting him?” Pethel asked chairman Anthony Dove, who answered “Yes.” “OK, well I’d appreciate if you’d do that … Like I said, my point is spending taxpayers’ money unnecessarily. I agree with going to school once or twice a year, but when you spend $1,600 more than you budgeted when you’re going and spending taxpayer money and staying in a hotel and eating off the county and all that, that is what I didn’t agree with.”
Thomas said Tuesday that he always eats cheaply when going to training and that he is not squandering any money by getting training that he said helps him understand local and state issues.
Larry Stewart, who is seeking the seat currently held by Bond on the BOC, took the podium at the conclusion of the meeting and said he could see all sides.
“I think the problem is not whether you’re over or under, and that sort of thing,” said Stewart. “I think from the public’s perspective, what is needed is a more transparent way of these budget amendments being made. It gives the appearance that people are spending money over their budget and that the money is being made up somehow and it’s being shuffled around and maybe something’s not quite right. I’m not saying that’s the case. But I’m saying it gives that appearance.”
The republicrats have no sense of fiscal responsibility at all. They have been spending money that the county doesn't have for quite some time now.
Ariel photographs, Watson's Mill, police cars, etc.,etc.,etc.
If they want to spend over budget, let them pay from their pockets and not mine.
as a new commissioner in 2011 I had to take courses to become certified. I took those courses and still I DID NOT GO OVER BUDGET.
I also did not vote to spend money on the ariel
photos and I did not vote to send Taxpayer money to the state DNR for Watson Mill. If the DNR would not transfer the fees collected at Watson Mill to the general funds of the DNR the park would support itself without our money. Also timber being cut at the park will be sold and those funds will be put in the DNR general fund account. Where that money will be spent is anyones guess.
You do deserve another term.
Everyone else needs to go! I'm tried of their silly,childish brickering, and their lack of concern and responsibility when spending money the county doesn't have on things it doesn't need.
Sorry,I shouldn't have included you with those scoundrels. Please accept my apology.
the compensation that is received for being a BOC member now. Hows that sound ?
The time to take classes, educate yourself, prepare, etc. for what it takes to be a commissioner is BEFORE you run for the office, NOT AFTER.
These commissioners should have to PAY US BACK ALL the money they have taken from us taxpayers for their "classes." If you have to take a class to learn about your elected office, take it on your OWN TIME with your OWN MONEY BEFORE you announce your candidacy. Ridiculous. It's like applying for a job, being hired, then showing up for work saying, "Duh...I lied. I don't know really how to do this job. Gimme some money to go take some classes."
65% over budget...63% over budget...35% over budget? Unacceptable. I see now how they do the math to have us working people in Madison County pay for everything from state parks to aerial views anyone can get for FREE on the internet!
Think about that. 63% over budget. What would happen your job and your home if you ran 63% over budget. You would be out of work and in the poorhouse, and, no surprise - look around, the poorhouse is exactly where Youngblood, Bond and Thomas have driven Madison County.
It would be funny if it weren't hurting our families, our children, our seniors, our property owners, our taxpayers, our county economy and our county employees so bad, day in and day out.
65%, 63%, 35% over budget? Nice enough guys to your face, but we simply can't afford Youngblood, Thomas, and Bond.
Commissioner Youngblood came by after reading my letter that I also forwarded to him. He was going to have a proper drainage ditch on the other side of the road so the run off water will stop eroding my property. He saw no speed limit signs anywhere on our road, he was going to fix that. The ground in front of our mailbox constantly gives way, he was going to have that fixed. We also have two dangerous S curves before and after my house and he was going to fix that too but so far there are no signs.
After I wrote the first letter and before Youngblood came to check it out, the county had come down and dug a deep hole where the drainage pipe is on the opposite side of the road, making the problem worse.
Here it is 8 months later and the only thing I noticed about a half mile from my house is a drive slow sign for a handicap dog! Go figure.
I guess this is what "small town living" is all about.
Christina Tuckey
I guess this is what "small town living" is all about."
After 3 years, I'm learning this as well. I e-mailed Mr. Bond about the need for the aerial photographs and at such great cost. I never heard back from him. I copied Anthony Dove and he answered some of my questions, but my representative never responded. It's disheartening and the kind of thing that makes people not want to vote or get involved in their communities; it just seems so pointless.
What mystery? That is their job. For this reason the county has spent a ton of money on aerial photography to make it easier to find structures not on the tax rolls. You have been cheating the rest of your fellow citizens by not paying taxes on your garage. You may not have realized this so your increase in taxes seem unfair to you now.
For years the garage was on the books and then off the books. When the county changed over to computer someone neglected to put the garage on the property listing. The only way to know that it was or was not being taxed would be to go to the tax office and have them print out the listing.
I have NOT cheated anyone!
I have been paying for a deck on the back of the house for 17 years, and it has been gone since the summer of 1995. I have requested it be removed but who knows when that will happen.
Next time ask questions before you call someone a CHEATER.
I did appeal my taxes and they did take a small amount off the value but nothing compared to the 249.00 we started paying in 1995. And then I got a delinquency notice for about 35.00 because while your appeal is in the process you pay 85% of your taxes.
Like I addressed earlier, I am still waiting for the speed limit signs, the S curve signs before each and for the road to be repaired so the ground stops washing away from the mailbox.
I am still waiting to see the drainage ditch dug so the water goes under the driveways on the opposite side of the road.
The last two bad storms have sent run-off water again and washed out some more of the dirt so we now have tree roots sticking up about four inches. When someone trips on them and gets hurt will my insurance have to pay for the injury that was on the easement of 30 to 35' from the center of the road.
I did not bother to contact Youngblood this time because he is not a man of his word. I did not call the road department because they don't even know the correct easement they have.
I compare my problems to the same reason for the overspending of budgets. They don't give a damn about the taxpayer only their money and how they can spend it and get more.
I have wondered how long it would take them to fix the drainage if we block that pipe and the water just backs up on the other side of the road.
When Youngblood was here he asked me if I voted and I said NO. He asked why and I said that I felt that all politicians were liars. They tell you what they think you want to hear then do nothing. If I do decide to vote it will not be for him or anyone else in office up there now.
But I can tell you if you were to block the drainage pipe so water would back up they would probably come out and arrest you and throw you in jail then fine you alot SO they would have more of YOUR money to blow?
Don't misunderstand me, I love where I live. It is just some of the j#$$%%# that run this county that I can't make myself agree with.
I say fire them all and start over with new people that are completely screened. Give them a probationary period to prove they are capable to do the job. IF after one year they fail to do what they should for the taxpayers, fire them and hire someone else. While you are hiring, hire a private person to investigate complaints by taxpayers. That way the county person can not worm his way out of it.
I have said for sometime now that somebody needs to go in and fire EVERYONE in the Madison County Government and hire all new people. Maybe hire some old time farmers with fourth grade educations? Because more education doesn't mean smarter? The BOC tells every Dept. they have to stick to a budget and they can't even stick to a budget themselves? Fire everyone of them and see how well they stick to their new budget of $0.00?
Show me someone worth voting for and I may just vote one day.. So far I see no one that fits the position.
I just feel if the keep bringing the issue up at some point it fall on the ears of someone that cares and can help us.
You can not look me in the eyes and tell me in this day and age of google and webinars that these guys need to drive all over the place stay in hotels to get a class on something they can google or that these classes can not be in Ebook form. It sounds to me like all the classes are just for members to meet great and make deals with each other.
Otherwise, what's to prevent any of these gentlemen from stealing thouands, even tens of thousands, more money?
Money has a funny way of disappearing in Madison County governement!
FROM MY LETTER TO THE EDITOR:
"Statements that it is imperative to go to training classes (at county expense) to know “the updates coming down from the state” are not correct, as far as I am concerned. I get emails from the state every day – more than one in a day, most of the time – that update me on “actions in Atlanta” that will affect citizens in our county. Why should we cause Madison County to go to the expense of sending us to training classes (lodging, food, mileage, etc.), other than the ones that are required for us to be certified?"
As to the rest of your comment... I don't know.